Marissa Ferrari - From Ms. Magazine to Mission-Driven Work

Welcome to Green Champions. Thanks for joining us in a conversation with real people sharing sustainability success stories. This podcast is a platform for green champions to share their stories and plant new ideas. I'm Dominique. And I'm Christy. And today we are very excited to be speaking with Marissa Ferrari.

She is partner and creative director at sustainable economies where her work supports mission-driven organizations working at the intersection of nature and communities. In our last episode, we chatted with Elizabeth about how she found her way to building sustainable economies with Marissa, and you may notice that their stories are intertwined.

Marissa spent most of her career in communications and brand strategy, and today we're getting to know Marissa as our green champion. Thanks for joining us today, Marissa. Thanks so much. I'm so happy to be here. But tell us a little bit about your background. Where did you grow up? Where, where was home for you when you were small?

Tell us about your journey. 

Sure. I grew up in a very small town in southwestern Michigan, and, uh, grew up kind of out in the country without a lot of houses around, not a lot of kids to play with. So I had a childhood experience that is now actually kind of rare. In that I was tained, yes. Um, I had a lot of time to myself and, uh, not a lot to do.

So the way that I spent my time was outside. I would go wander through the woods behind our house. And take saws and hatchets and build tree. I was not ready for you to pull out like equipment. I love it. Listen, there were three girls in our family. We did all the things. I love it. Um, and so, you know, chopping wood and hauling wood was part of that.

So when it came to building tree forts and whatnot, we had some skills. Um, but I also spent a lot of time wandering the creeks and meadows and natural places around our house in the country. And so the natural world was always a second home for me. I love this and we would be remiss if we did not say that.

Elizabeth also talked about tree forts. And I'm a big tree fort girl as well. I think that we've had this in common. I don't know this, this just feels pretty special. I just have to call that out. Thank you for sharing your tree fort story. Yeah, yeah. I love that. 

Okay, and then you at some point found a passion in in ENG English and studied English in college.

I did. How did you get there? You know, um, I think like a lot of kids, I grew up believing that the most important thing that I could do was become a doctor. So I actually started out as a biomed major because I was always good at math and science and, um, I quickly discovered that. That was maybe something that I was good at, but not where my passion and my heart, uh, was centered.

And all I wanted to do was take the classes that were about the 18th century French novel or Chicano literature. Or the art of poetry. And so I think after my very first semester, I switched my major to literature and I also double majored in women's studies. And so there you go. I managed to graduate college without a single marketable skill.

I disagree. Yes. Our current status has, has proven that to, to be untrue, but yes. Understood. How did, how did some of those interests lead to communications? Because some of those are things that you've mentioned like. Women's studies and poetry could have led you another direction. Yeah. Um, well, you know, I actually, um, found myself doing a couple of internships during my, during my junior year.

 one of them was at a magazine that you might have heard of. It's called MS. Magazine, which was really influential, during the second wave of feminism. it probably reached its heightened popularity in the 1970s and eighties, and it was founded, by a very famous second wave feminist, called Gloria Steinem.

And, um, when I interned there, Gloria Steinem was still active with the magazine. I actually got to go to a holiday party at her house. And I honestly thought that I had gone to died and gone to heaven. it was just like I lived in New York City and I took the subway to Wall Street every day, and that was my life.

 and my job at the magazine was to write articles and to do research and, that was my dream to become a writer. And I had this vision for myself that I was gonna go to New York. I was gonna intern at this magazine and after my internship, they were gonna offer me a job and I, that was gonna be what I was gonna do.

Um, but I was so young and so inexperienced that when it didn't work out that way. I thought that I was a failure, and I thought that because the way I pictured my career unfolding, it didn't happen that way. I thought that that meant that I wasn't supposed to be a writer. Mm-hmm. And so I kind of went back and finished my undergraduate degree.

With my tail between my legs feeling like, ugh, this dream that I thought that I had and what I thought I was meant to do wasn't actually gonna happen. 

Then what? Um, then I ended up, um, you know, kind of following this circuitous path, um, which, you know, I guess if I had. Some advice, um, to share with people who are interested in a career in sustainability or interested in a career as a creative mm-hmm.

Um, would be to embrace that circuitous path. Um, because I had so many different experiences, um, I did a program called AmeriCorps, which is like the domestic version of the Peace Corps. Mm-hmm. Um, which led me to a career in economic development. I then became an in-house copywriter for a corporate music related business.

I then became a content director for an advertising agency. I then worked as a marketing director for the largest school district in Colorado, so on and so on. Wow. Um. And today in my consulting work and in my role as a creative director advising nonprofits and public sector agencies, I use each and every one of those experiences to guide our clients and the situations that they're encountering, whether it's operations or finance, or strategy or identity.

Um, it, those kind of well-rounded experiences actually help me advise them from a much wider lens than if I had only trained as a writer or as a creative all the way through. Um, so, you know, if your career path and your dream doesn't follow a straight line, that might be a good thing. And, and what was your AmeriCorps placement?

That was a big part of. Uh, like the start of your story, what, what were you placed doing? Yeah, so if you can imagine this, this was pre-internet, um, and I was hired to research and write a housing study. Um, so a study on housing affordability in Kalamazoo County, Michigan. And in order to gather data on housing affordability, I had to actually go to these housing related nonprofits and these affordable housing centers and complexes and developments and physically in person, ask them questions about.

Rental rates and occupancy and gather all of this data in person rather than doing research online, which is, you know, how so many of us do research today. And interestingly enough, I think that that, um, some of those early experiences contributed to my training, but also my appreciation for the kind of research that Elizabeth and I do.

Through sustainable economies today, which is very, um, it's qualitative research, but it's very relationship oriented where we spend time talking with people through one-on-one interviews or through focus groups where we're actually spending time in communities, getting to know the stakeholders who actually make, um, the work of these nonprofits possible.

And building those relationships, um, partly on behalf of the nonprofits that we're partnering with. 

I love the human approach to what you're talking about and, and to you, and you know, you've described yourself. I'm gonna describe you as human-centric 'cause that's, that's what you've said, but you've also described yourself as a brand strategist, essayist, part-time philosopher, and a lifelong tree hugger.

Tell me about those different, um, views of yourself and how does that show up today? Yeah, well, you know, I think I identify as a writer. As I was telling you, my dream was to become a writer. I've always been looking for ways to spend more time writing and to make that part of my professional life. And writing is really about telling stories, um, and there's a reason why storytelling is so powerful and so enduring.

And, uh, part of that is because as a society, as human beings, we are hardwired to love stories. And so the nonprofits that do storytelling really well are the ones that can help their audiences envision a different future for themselves as well. And the ones that are really good are the ones that place their audiences as the hero in the story.

They're the ones that say, think about the change that you can make happen if you take this action or if you care about this issue. And that's one of the reasons why storytelling is so powerful. Another reason why storytelling is so powerful is that we use data and facts to make decisions, but even more so, we make decisions based on emotions.

Um, and I have one example that comes from another industry, from retail, but there's a store in Toronto, Ontario. Um, where you can buy hockey sticks. I come from a hockey family. My current family is a hockey family. Um, and in this store there are brand new high-end hockey sticks that have the latest designs and the best materials and anything you could ever want.

But the real reason that people go to this store is for the used. Hockey sticks that are, have been used for an entire season, they're totally beat up. They look terrible, but they've been used by NHL players in their practices and games and little kids and grown men walk out of there holding their hockey sticks.

'cause they're like, mm-hmm. This stick has been used by my favorite guy, and there's a story that goes with that hockey stick and that story is priceless. Mm-hmm. I can also see how, how well you and Elizabeth collaborate together from hearing, you know, talking to her last time about like the data-driven approaches and some of that being like the beginning of her journey.

Um. And then you being like, yeah, data's really helpful, but storytelling is the magic. And I can just see how like you both fit together really well to be really strong partners to deliver what you gotta do. Um, so that's really awesome. And it seems like you also were just somebody who is so natural at like taking initiative, um, and having a vision, and that's a big part of how you're a creative director, how you have run a business.

Um, but tell us more about how that showed up in your life. Like when did you. Maybe learn that was a strength of yours. 

 I've been really lucky at, in many times in my life to have leaders and managers who have said to me, go for it. as long as it's something that. You can do within the resources that are available to you.

 the sky's the limit. I had a creative director actually in my first copywriting role 

 he really taught me that work is the way that you learn and grow and develop your craft. And so he would give me project after project after project, and it was a way for me to get better. that ambition or the desire to do more and to be more, just to push the limits of what's possible and to see what you can accomplish.

Is not a value that is very often, celebrated in women. Mm-hmm. especially when I was younger. I literally would have teachers who would be like, Marissa, please stop raising your hand. And, there for a long time, that was a voice that was in the back of my head. And that don't be too ambitious, right?

Mm-hmm. Yeah. Or if I were shining, it would be taking away from someone else. Mm-hmm. And, having my own practice, um, for better or for worse, allowed me to see how much I could accomplish without feeling like I was taking something away from somebody else or. Having somebody put that thought into my mind.

Mm-hmm. I'm really glad you mentioned that, and I think that it's unfortunately a, a more common experience, you know, that like beyond just yourself. And so it's nice to hear someone that like, has really found their way and does I, I think that you carry yourself so well and I think that you are clearly a leader and to know that at like some point.

There was internal friction around what the world was telling you. it's just so interesting and I honestly was gonna ask you before you said that, which is interesting, but you don't really describe yourself as an entrepreneur or entrepreneurial, even though you are. But like when I've just seen you write about your yourself and your identity, that that word doesn't come up as much.

Like, what are your thoughts on that? Do you identify as being entrepreneurial? Do you intentionally identify differently? 

 I think I identify first and foremost as a creative. And, you know, as we discussed, I had always wanted to find a way to be a writer, in addition to wanting to find a way to be a professional tree hugger. Um, check and check, check and check. And, you know, I really love being able to guide mission-driven organizations through the process of developing their brand.

Because it is such a creative pursuit. There is a science to it. Even though we've talked a lot about storytelling, it is incredibly data driven. It is very research based. Um, but there is a moment when. There is a judgment call that has to be made and there are stylistic choices that have to be made that rely on taste level and artistic decisions, and that's a way for me to partner with those organizations to use my artistic sensibilities and my creative skills to.

Help guide them in the most strategic direction, but also in an artful way. And so I love bringing the art and science together and being able to do that as an entrepreneur just kind of is like the icing on the cake. I love that. I love that you keep talking about Chef as a creative and a writer and, maybe it's something I, I wanna see more of it myself, but I just love that about you.

And this is Christie's Creative year, by the way. Yes, this is my year of creativity. Awesome. Podcast. And, and try new things. So yes, I'm working on my creativity this year. Um, but you said something, you had a post on LinkedIn for MLK Day. And I'm not gonna, it stopped me in my tracks and I spent so much time thinking about it.

Hmm. Um, thank you. So let, so yeah, let me tell you what that post was for listeners. So Marissa had this post and it said, what would the world be like if Martin Luther King Jr. Had been a writer? what is it about great communicators that move you and inspire you? Mm-hmm. Thank you for asking that question. Um, this may sound a little cliche, but. Martin Luther King Jr. Was one of the people who inspired me to become a writer because I remember being in school as a very young child and watching his, I have a dream speech with my class and just being like having an outof body experience.

Right. You know, just being so moved. And feeling like this is what I want to do with my life. Not necessarily being the one to stand at the podium and deliver the speech, but it was the first time I really realized, and I'm sure I didn't realize it fully at eight years old or whatever, but realizing that an idea.

Has the power truly to change the world. And again, that's can, that statement can sound trite, but Martin Luther King Jr. And so many others have used the pen or use their words to lead social movements or movements for justice. Have resulted in so much change for the better in our society and in places all over the world.

 I know we're gonna get more into your champion story with Elizabeth and how you started sustainable economies and the impact you're having now. 

Um, and I kind of think a good way to maybe bring us home, uh, on that note is asking you what's bringing you hope right now? There's so many things going on in our world.

Mm-hmm. And I think you brought some of that for me, even just like with what you just said, but Yeah. What, what's bringing you hope right now? Um, and the work that you do or just in your daily life? Mm. I mean, one idea that, you know, when I think of myself as a part-time philosopher, one idea that I. Keeps circling around endlessly is this idea of connection.

We have forgotten that we are actually part of nature and we are Nature and nature is us, and there is nothing that separates us from nature and everything, and everyone is connected and. What that means is that our health and wellbeing as a human species is inextricably linked with the health of our planet.

 It's not new, but I think that more people are remembering that connectedness and seeking.

A more daily experience of being one with nature and a more, what I would describe as a right relationship with the earth. Um, that's not my term, that's borrowed from indigenous communities who have been here long before, colonial settlers. But, I think that sense of connectedness and a strong desire to restore that relationship is what gives me hope.

Thank you for that and thank you for our whole chat today. I appreciate just the way that you look at things and it is so fun and refreshing to talk about sustainability and some our environmental conversations through the lens of like creativity. Um, and passion. And I also appreciate how much you've just been honest about like your personal experience and some of like the real life sticky parts that have been pivotal in your journey, but like, not knowing what's next, finding the non-linear path uncomfortable.

Um, I relate to that a lot. Um, and I think that's like. Yeah, I'm actually grateful the way that you, you painted it. Um, and then also ways that like, you know, society sometimes, like maybe can make it hard to see certain qualities in yourself. So thanks for sharing you. Thank you. It's been a pleasure. 

 one thing that. Stood out to me in some ways was talking about how, you know, your first professional, um, engagement was, you know, working for MS. Magazine with Gloria Steinem and how your, your path happened. And there's not a cell in my body that believes that. Um. Or every cell in my body believes that she'd be so proud of you right now.

Like Right. You know what I mean? And so I think that as we, um, grow and learn in that connectivity and, um, to people and nature, yeah. You've just, you've done it and it's just amazing. I just want to recognize that. Mm-hmm. Thank you. Thank you. You. How can people connect with you and support the work that you're doing?

Thank you. Um, you can find us on LinkedIn at Sustainable Economies. Well, thank you for such a, a, a great conversation. And at Green Champions, we love having all these different conversations about how different people approach sustainability. because we know that climate action takes many forms.

As always, you can find our episodes and support the show@thegreenchampions.com. If you enjoyed the episode, please follow, subscribe, and leave us a review on your favorite podcast platform. stay connected with us on LinkedIn and Instagram at Green Champions Pod. Our music is by Zane Dwe. Thanks listening to Green Champions.

We'll be back next time with Marissa and Elizabeth's green champion story.